@anybody Coffins can't be global, is that right? I have to save a coffin into a global box in order to keep it? Just wondering if that means I'm misusing coffins in the first place ...

@cfr @anybody is @JosephWright most likely!

anyway, good old \global\let\MyCoffin\MyCoffin may work :-)

@yo' That would be cheating. Does it work with expl3 syntax anyway? What I want is something like \g_prefix_name_coffin and the fact that I'm not meant to have one makes me suspect I'm using them wrong. But, I think you are right about the identity of @anybody. Right now, I just save the coffin in a box. But that seems unnecessarily awkward!

@cfr ah damn, I opened texdoc xcoffins instead of interface3 :-(

@yo' Well, it isn't as if I told you which I was using. I just find the expl3 syntax easier, actually. I don't know why.

@cfr They are (currently) local-only constructs

@yo' No, the coffin comprises a box and a prop: you have to worry about both

@cfr you can't really save a coffin in a box, it would just be a box then

@JosephWright I'd completely forgotten about that luaotfload version check :(

@DavidCarlisle I suspect they are working on a 'TeX Live only' cycle ...

@JosephWright but what about me??? I'm on luatex 1.02 :(

@DavidCarlisle Have you mailed Philipp Gesang directly?

@JosephWright Yes (at least I think I did, I'll check...)

@DavidCarlisle Will mail you

@DavidCarlisle we wub you

@PauloCereda well fix luaotfload then:-)

@DavidCarlisle I can help with moral support. :)

@PauloCereda Pato típico, todos charlatão e nenhuma ação

@DavidCarlisle o.O

wrong sort of "quack" I suspect

@egreg Seems @DavidCarlisle is winning this time...

@yo' as it should be

@yo' Well, he's telling lies in his last answer

@egreg attended Trump University? :D

@egreg not now, I think. Anyway it's winning that counts, don't be a poor loser:-)

@DavidCarlisle Sorry, but “space token” is wrong.

@egreg it says space character (now)

@DavidCarlisle With thanks, I presume.

@egreg implied, naturally!

Another review saying my paper is too much British...

@PauloCereda a second compliment? :) What journal is it for?

@yo' it's a conference paper, actually. :) It's happening in Portugal, I should ask David to translate it for me. :)

@PauloCereda oh, well, the paper must be really flawless if the reviewers care so much about the English :)

@PauloCereda start the paper with G'day, mates then they will accept that you are not using UK English.

@yo' Not that much. :)

@DavidCarlisle ooh I like this plan. :)

@PauloCereda check with @WillRobertson first

@DavidCarlisle Then my paper will sound too much Australian. :)

@DavidCarlisle :)

I could change a coauthor's name to Bruce...

@JosephWright ^^

@DavidCarlisle Here, we talk about our bonza results

@JosephWright you do realise that @PauloCereda trusts us implicitly and will do anything we suggest.

@DavidCarlisle indubitably, ol' chap.

@JosephWright do you have a luatex 0.95 still available to check the latest format change, I have the original texlive binaries but not set up to run in parallel

@DavidCarlisle Give me a mo

@JosephWright ^^ this is from a published paper of mine. :)

@PauloCereda Is that your usual breakfast? ;-)

@egreg Nope. :)

@PauloCereda I was expecting feijoada for breakfast.

@egreg No. Normally he has spam, spam , spam and spam.

@DavidCarlisle With spam coffee.

@PauloCereda could your paper deal with multisets? ^^

@egreg holy cow, you have no idea how powerful feijoada is. :)

@DavidCarlisle oh no

@PauloCereda Good to start a day with! But perhaps not on a shaky bus. :-D

@PauloCereda only one portion of spam allowed then

@egreg Definitely not. :)

@DavidCarlisle :)

Do we have any examples on best practice for specifying packages options when creating a expl3 based package? I have my (private) re-imagination of fancyref, which works quite well. But when used with memoir \fref and \Fref is already defined, so I'd like to provide an overload option, that just undo any existing \fref and \Fref`.

@PauloCereda -- if you want a more u.s. breakfast, substitute hash browns for beans. spam is okay if you're in hawaii.

@barbarabeeton ooh :)

@DavidCarlisle: how are Skimble and Jennyanydots? :)

@PauloCereda stupid

@DavidCarlisle that's mean

@daleif Interesting — I've wondered for a long time which I prefer of the fancyref vs refstyle packages in terms of syntax.

@daleif But to answer your question, not really :)

@WillRobertson G'day mate!

@DavidCarlisle ^^

@PauloCereda we should have got some intelligent animals as pets like a stick insect or something

@DavidCarlisle you have a duck

@DavidCarlisle oh no

@DavidCarlisle: I blame Herr Schumacher

@PauloCereda somebody put it in an envelope with no air

@DavidCarlisle LOL

@daleif Although you probably would be interested in the l3keys2e package!

@daleif My position would be make it load-time only if necessary, otherwise provide a \<thing>setup or similar interface

@PauloCereda G'day

@PauloCereda and g'night :)

@WillRobertson yay

@WillRobertson oh no

@WillRobertson g'week'nd

@WillRobertson: it's +12h, I always forget. :)

@JosephWright I just think \usepackage[overload]{xfancyref} is a nicer interface than \xfancysetup{overload} and relaying macro definitions. But so far the package is just for my own projects and I give it to some students, so I might even just auto redefine if memoir is loaded.

@daleif Sure: that is likely to be a load-time option

@WillRobertson I just tend to like being able to know from the source what I get in the output. Plus since it only acts on the label, then you don't have to spend a lot of time making your own special macro solutions work with cleverref. Grated of course that cleveref can do much more than xfancyref, it has so far been enough for my projects.

Under expl3, what is the proper method for writing say Foo~\foo~and to the log (as info). I tried \PackageInfo and Foo~\string\foo~and which works, but the space before and is missing.

@daleif You need \c_space_tl there: just as in the normal case, spaces are dropped after csnames, it's just that ~ is a space!

@daleif You should really use the msg module for messages, BTW

@JosephWright I have for some of it. I'm just lazy, too much work ;-)

@PauloCereda GMT+9.5 or GMT+10.5 for me, depending on time of the year :)

oh. :)

@JosephWright

@DavidCarlisle

hello

<< fontspec v2.5c has been uploaded to CTAN :)

I hope it's not broken :)

@WillRobertson Fingers crossed

I'll be around again Sunday night my time to fix anything if so!!

@WillRobertson ooh we have no excuse now not to send the rest:-)

@DavidCarlisle You or me?

@JosephWright I haven't re-added all my old tests to the build.lua test suite... but the documentation itself compiles so that's probably a good sign

@JosephWright was going to ask the same, I'm possibly busy at weekend or I could do it tonight, or you could ...

Oops it's now really late... better run. Good night and good weekend!

@good night, we'll try not to blame you for too much while you're offline:-)

@JosephWright did you manage to run the test suite with 0.95? (

@DavidCarlisle OK, I'll do it then: upload probably this evening

@DavidCarlisle Yes and no: as you've checked in .tlg files that need LuaTeX v1 there are some failures with v0.95, but nothing to worry about

@JosephWright ah mainly didn't output a version error:-)

@DavidCarlisle Seems to be OK

@JosephWright so the list of bundles as in my mail then:-) latex-base, latex-amsmath, latex-tools, latexbug, graphics-def what could go wrong.....

@DavidCarlisle Understood: I'll do a few more checks this evening then make the release archives

@JosephWright sounds good

@DavidCarlisle Running all of the tests now

@DavidCarlisle With LuaTeX v1.0.2

@JosephWright ah should pass then I hope since that's what mine claims to be as well

@JosephWright I guess l3build wouldn't want to build a ctan archive if the tests failed:-)

@DavidCarlisle No, which is why I need to run things on a Windows system (where I have v1.0.2 and so the tests pass), not on my Mac (v0.95)

@JosephWright things are always better on windows

@PauloCereda: -17°C this morning ... :D

@ChristianHupfer OH MY

@PauloCereda Perfect temperatures for Frozen Duck, fresh from the pond ;-)

@ChristianHupfer you mean :)

@PauloCereda It's a perfect time in the morning, driving eastwards, having the rising sun casting all tones of red on a snowy and icy landscape

@ChristianHupfer it's cold. :)

@PauloCereda Yes....

@PauloCereda: Dear sir, I put it to you that you ... don't like the coldness on purpose! ;-)

@ChristianHupfer o.O

@PauloCereda it's fine, just -12C forecast for the night

@yo' brrrrr

@DavidCarlisle For my purposes, it works well enough. Doubtless I could just use a box, but coffins are easier to figure out.

@JosephWright Hmmm.... I'll keep saving it in a box, then. It just seems less flexible this way. And rather inelegant ;).

@DavidCarlisle @JosephWright Thanks.

@cfr As always, a use case is handy :) We have talked on the team about the global/local business with coffins: boxes are still somewhat under-tested compared with other areas

@cfr: Cwac! <3

@cfr honestly I can't guess how you do that at all, the whole point about coffins is that they have multiple handles, if you just save the inner box structure and remove the handles, you've got a dead body on the floor and no way to move it.

@DavidCarlisle @JosephWright @egreg Wikiook edit from today Is it an improvement, or was the former just enough information?

@Johannes_B \textsubscript used to need fixltx2e, so I'd say it's good.

CM13 successfully deployed on my tablet. :)

@PauloCereda I still see 10.2 on my tablet. Oh, wait, there's iOS in front of the number: does it mean something?

@egreg Oh no! :)

@egreg: for an old, unsupported tablet like mine, having Android 6.0 is a big achievement. :)

@PauloCereda Lectures done sitting on a chair and writing on the tablet are a bit more comfortable than writing on a long blackboard.

@egreg ooh you should get an iPad pro!

@PauloCereda The standard one fits the bill.

@egreg Awesome. :)

Hello, TeX chat o/ Should I be worried that there is a highly-starred coffin comment just a few hours old? =O

@Jan don't worry, they are reserved for vim users

I have a quick question. Is there a (La)TeX-internal length parameter that I could use to extract the distance from a page’s left margin to the left margin of an itemize \item?

@DavidCarlisle Frequently using Vim makes me worry even more …

@Jan \@totalleftmargin

@Jan you should use emacs (ask @PauloCereda)

@Jan oh or rather the difference between that and \@oddsidemargin or \@evensidemargn

@David Thanks, that looks like it’s working =)

@DavidCarlisle I know. It isn't good. But, you know, a stiff is better than an empty coffin.

@PauloCereda Cwac ;)