Good maen

@ChristianHupfer Once more a toaster Q/A for you. Is this understandable? texwelt.de/wissen/fragen/113/…

@Johannes_B Yes, pretty clear

@ChristianHupfer Thanks.

@ChristianHupfer I was asking because ... well ... mrunix.de/forums/…

@Johannes_B You're fighting teaching at too much positions ... ;-) MrUnix, GoLaTeX, TexWelt, TeX.SX, LC and at billions of other places I can't imagine right now

@ChristianHupfer I am not fighting. Wouldn't call it teaching either ;-)

@Johannes_B ;-)

@UlrikeFischer Do you know if there's a list somewhere of MiKTeX versions and the matching engine binaries?

@JosephWright No. Why do you need it?

@UlrikeFischer Trying to work out which MiKTeX versions have which engine versions :-) For TeX Live it's easy, but not so for MiKTeX.

@UlrikeFischer Guess I'll have to mail Christian

@JosephWright I guessed that. But why? (Beside this every miktex version had in general more than one engine versions. In 2.7. or 2.8. the xetex versions changed often in few days.)

@JosephWright I deny any relationship with MikTeX :D ... thanks for mentioning TeXLive -- almost forgot to update

@UlrikeFischer Working on the support matrix for expl3: with TeX Live, we can say 'we can support TeX Live X, Y, Z ...' based on 'TeX Live X = LuaTeX n, pdfTeX m, XeTeX p', but that's not immediately obviously the same for MiKTeX

@JosephWright I don't think that a matrix with miktex versions make much sense. 2.9. is now around for quite a number of years and you can't know which versions of the binaries the user have. It would be better make a matrix based on engine versions and (if needed) format version.

@UlrikeFischer That was my feeling too, but there's a contrast in approaches which make life interesting (for TL, we know we can say simply 'TL version X' has all of the required binaries). Of course, the fact that MiKTeX is far less likely to be set up in a 'controlled' way makes things a bit less tricky for end users.

@UlrikeFischer We do specify by engine version, but the problem is end users don't decide 'I'll install pdfTeX 1.40' :-)

@JosephWright The end user installs everything in one go and get newer versions with the update manager. So he should get matching expl3/engines anyway (if he doesn't fall in the user/admin trap). Users who want to install an current expl3 in an older miktex manually should know how find out the engine versions.

@JosephWright: expl3 does not know the concept of optional arguments -- is that correct? I've to provide with outer wrappers (\newcommand[2][] or \NewDocumentCommand etc.)?

@ChristianHupfer Optional arguments are a document-layer concept, so no not at the code (expl3) layer

@JosephWright Ok, I've understood interface3.pdf correctly in this feature. Thanks

@ChristianHupfer you shouldn't ever need them in expl3 ;-)

@UlrikeFischer Yes, my feeling too. Now I just have to sell this to the rest of the team :-)

@yo' No, probably not. The \cs_generate_variant is really a nice feature

@ChristianHupfer yep, but that's yet another thing, completely perpendicular to the concept of optional arguments

@yo' Yes, I just wanted to mention why I am fascinated by expl3

@ChristianHupfer “Aus dem Paradies, das das \LaTeX3 Team uns geschaffen, soll uns niemand vertreiben können”

@egreg Paradies? :D Rather Dante's Inferno -- Abandon all hope

@ChristianHupfer Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate

@egreg Ah, the Italian version..

@ChristianHupfer In current Italian it would be Lasciate ogni speranza, voi che entrate

@egreg Going to be my new slogan ... Thanks

@ChristianHupfer I'll stay with Hilbert's style.

@egreg I voted for Ulrike of course:-)

@DavidCarlisle :P

@DavidCarlisle I couldn't avoid my, as usual, overlong and too informative answer.

@DavidCarlisle Anyway, I'm already rep capped. Are you?

@egreg no I'm busy making matlab segfault (day job:-)

@DavidCarlisle It shouldn't be too difficult.

@egreg apparently not. Although I can't see why, if I alter some perfectly working code, it should stop working.

@DavidCarlisle Very reliable software under that respect.

@egreg see above

@egreg oh actually I'm a lot closer than I expected (180) :-)

Hi, I've got a brief question:

I'm trying to draw an in-line circle

It should be of the same height as e.g. $\triangle$ and $\square$ (so $\circ$ won't do...)

I found it surprisingly difficult to find how to do this online... could someone help me out?

@Danu Here it is:

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{amssymb,pict2e}
\newcommand{\danucircle}{\mathord{\mathpalette\dodanucircle\relax}}
\newcommand{\dodanucircle}[2]{%
  \sbox0{$#1\square$}%
  \setlength{\unitlength}{\ht0}%
  \begin{picture}(1.2,1)
  \put(0.6,0.5){\circle{1}}
  \end{picture}%
}
\begin{document}
$\triangle\square\danucircle\square$
\end{document}

@Danu It will also change size in subscripts/superscripts

A “more proper” version:

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{amssymb,pict2e}

\makeatletter
\newcommand{\danucircle}{\mathord{\mathpalette\danu@circle\relax}}
\newcommand{\danu@circle}[2]{%
  \sbox\z@{$\m@th#1\square$}%
  \setlength{\unitlength}{\ht\z@}%
  \begin{picture}(1.2,1)
  \put(0.6,0.5){\circle{1}}
  \end{picture}%
}
\makeatother

\begin{document}
$\triangle\square\danucircle\square_{\danucircle\square}$
\end{document}

@egreg Thanks a lot! Is there no standard command? That surprises me.

@Danu There is \bigcirc, but it's much bigger than \square.

@egreg Strange...

Thanks a lot, anyways :)

@Danu @barbarabeeton worked hard to get matching sized geometric operators in to unicode, so if you are using unicode fonts you are in better shape perhaps.

should be migrated to the main site:

@RomainPicot Thanks, I migrated it to the main site

@ChristianHupfer I should invite this person for dinner tex.stackexchange.com/users/89496/unknownbeef

@Johannes_B Could be Gammelfleisch ;-)

@ChristianHupfer Maybe :-)

@Johannes_B 55 people tasted

@StefanKottwitz Oy.

@Johannes_B according to the profile, ~55 people. I just don't know if it's rounded up or rounded down.

@StefanKottwitz Oh no, you made the pictures even worse :-)

I am off ... unsuccessful day here on StackExchange ...

@Johannes_B Now you know the origin of "unknown beef" - clippings in rounding user numbers

@ChristianHupfer if you feel so, I hope your other days will be better :-) Bye now!

@ChristianHupfer Why? +305 for me. ;-)

@PauloCereda where are you:-)

@DavidCarlisle Probably at SP or on a shaky bus heading home.

@egreg you can answer the arara one then