/dev/chat

Huh? I always get confused between the two. -sa is automatic, -si is include, right? Ummmm.... checks man page... nope, a is always, i is intelligent.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert no idea what you are talking about.

derobert

@FaheemMitha the dpkg-genchanges flag

Faheem Mitha

@derobert oh

What does that have to do with anything?

What command were you using to build?

derobert

debuild -uc -us -si, when it should have been debuild -uc -us -sa

Or maybe I left off -si entirely

Faheem Mitha

@derobert Why is -si necessary?

And why would you want to use -sa anyway? Didn't you increment the version number?

derobert

12:12 AM

-si is the default. But -sa is needed, because it's being uploaded to my internal archive...

Didn't increment the upstream version

But I need an orig.tar.gz included (because my internal server doesn't have one yet)

Faheem Mitha

@derobert Oh, Ok. Hmm, right.

Hang on, didn't you have a orig.tar.gz already. you are doing a backport, right?

By default it wouldn't touch the orig.tar.gz, which is the right thing to do in this case.

derobert

Correct. But it won't be included in the .changes file without -sa

-sa won't touch it either, it'll just use the existing one

anyway, have to run

Faheem Mitha

Oh, you need it in the changes file? Why? Because you are adding to an apt mirror?

derobert

@FaheemMitha Yep, because I've actually got an archive set up, and the management software processes .changes files.

should have left 20m ago... leaving!

Faheem Mitha

@derobert Oh. An apt archive?

@derobert Ok. Take care.

derobert

12:20 AM

@FaheemMitha yes

Faheem Mitha

@derobert reprepro, or something else?

derobert

12:36 AM

mini-dinstall

Faheem Mitha

@derobert never heard of it. Do you prefer it to reprepro, and if so, why?

Does anyone have a take on this?

@FaheemMitha Looks like there has been ~14 commits to mplayer.c since 2012. Last commit was 2014-05-20. Not a perfect means of measurement, but that will give a good idea of activity. Looks like there have been ~7023 commits to FFmpeg since 2014-05-20. Also not a perfect measurement because that includes all commits to the whole project. — LordNeckbeard 5 hours ago

Does a small number of commits mean a project is dead/dying/dormant/inactive?

Faheem Mitha

12:52 AM

Hmm, mini-dinstall looks interesting. Though not very active.

Faheem Mitha

1:44 AM

Hi @Caleb. I gather your top ranked user on christianity.sx died. How are you guys holding up?

casey

2:25 PM

@FaheemMitha if you manage a lot of machines it makes a lot of sense to run a local APT archive. That way local machines only generate local traffic to the local APT archive and only the archive only ever downloads something once. It also facilitates doing what derobert is doing and making slightly different packages available site-wide in place of what is in an official archive mirror.

@FaheemMitha my take on that is apples vs oranges. mplayer.c is a single file in a source repo, which FFMpeg is an entire project. To make a comparison you'd need total commits to the MPlayer SVN repo, not just one file.

Faheem Mitha

3:08 PM

@casey agreed

@casey it's actually mencoder.c.

But yes, that's not enough info for a comparison.

derobert

4:48 PM

@FaheemMitha All the cool kids have switched to mpv, I think :-P

You'd have to look not just at number of commits, but size/importance... but I'd bet # commits is strongly correlated with how much a project is changing.

Doesn't mean its dead, just that it's not changing. Could also mean its done.

@FaheemMitha Not sure, if I checked out reprepo it was years ago, when I set up mini-dinstall.

If it even existed then...

Faheem Mitha

@derobert Reprepro has been around for a while. I was using it like 10 years ago, I think.

Actually, there are those handy things called changelogs...

@derobert I don't think software is ever done. But it could be mature, true.

From the changelog, it looks like reprepro entered Debian in Feb 2005. Pretty close to 10 years ago.

If I was using it then, I'd have been an early adopter. Maybe I misremember.

casey

I'm certainly not a cool kid anymore then, since I still use vlc

derobert

@casey That's what the Windows folks used. Next you'll be telling us you use Visual C++.

casey

for local viewing (not common anymore). These days I use mediatomb (DLNA/uPNP) on my computer, localcast on my android devices and a chromecast on my TV to watch stuff

derobert

5:04 PM

I found MediaTomb (and PS3 Media Server, I think was the other one) to be a PITA... so I just connected a PC to the TV. Much easier!

casey

@derobert I'm happy to say I have avoided that very well. Back in my windows days (3.1 mostly and some 95) I always used Borland's C++ compilers :)

@derobert I setup mediatomb a long time ago but never got around to fully setting it up. It pairs better with localcast than my PS3 though

as my PS3 can't understand .mkv containers and I'm not going to figure out a transcoding rule to repackage it on the fly

derobert

@casey I had all the transcoding set up (as almost everything I watch is subtitled, mkv being very common).

Convert to hardsub, encode to MPEG-2 with constant quantizer, shove 50mbps in the PS3's general direction.

Glad I switched to a PC, so much less trouble. Also, the Ethernet port on my PS3 broke :-(

So now its on WiFi (11g, doesn't even do n), instead of gig-e, no way to send 50mbps to it.

casey

yea, thats more work than I bothered with, but lack of subtitles is a pain. My wife does not appreciate audio with high dynamic range, so the loud parts are quiet and the quiet parts are inaudible :(

derobert

@casey you could compand it, I suppose.

casey

localcast however will let me run the audio through my android device instead of the TV

@derobert I'm just going to wait for vlc to get around to supporting chromecast and it can worry about the subtitles

though I havent checked if localcast can manage mkv with subtitles included. I don't think it can manage .srt files external the container. Time for some experimentation.

derobert

5:13 PM

There are apparently some CLI tools to do Chromecast streaming. After of course transcoding with ffmpeg.

casey

hmm, didn't manage to make subtitles work but did find some of my media that the chromecast cannot decode

derobert

I have a ton of that. Yeah high10 profile!

casey

though the PS3 can decode those files.

@derobert there are a ton of tools now, too many to wade through

I bought my chromecasts when there were no tools and only youtube and netflix and perhaps 2 other apps supported them

since they opened up the API the number of apps has exploded. Lots of crap and the quality takes some effort to find

derobert

@casey Yeah. I got mine on release day too :-)

casey

:)

derobert

5:23 PM

@FaheemMitha I'd guess this mini-dinstall repo is probably 2006. So I guess reprepro existed at the time...

(hmmm... 32-bit sssd build failed out. Odd. Will try without -B, maybe its a bug...)

derobert

5:44 PM

/bin/bash ./libtool --tag=CC --mode=link gcc  -Wall -Wshadow -Wstrict-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -W
libtool: link: gcc -Wall -Wshadow -Wstrict-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -Wcast-qual -Wcast-align -Wwr
/bin/bash: src/sysv/systemd/: No such file or directory
make[3]: *** [src/sysv/systemd/sssd.service] Error 127
make[3]: Leaving directory `/home/anthony/sssd/sssd-1.11.7/build'
make[2]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1
make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/anthony/sssd/sssd-1.11.7/build'
make[1]: *** [all] Error 2

... wonder why it built on amd64, but not i386.

(and yes, I truncated those huge lines)

UGH. automake 1.9 v. 1.11.

derobert

5:59 PM

@FaheemMitha BTW, I'm not sure if I should try to get this in wheezy-backports. For one thing, it's going to be a time investment to maintain—I had to rebuild krb5 as well, and both it and sssd need security support.

And I'm guessing I'll just upgrade our Wheezy machines to Jessie once its out.

DummyBeginner

6:26 PM

Hi, Is 'Tor' pre-installed on ubuntu 14.04? I don't recall installed it on my system, but it's there!
Any way to check packages installation date and distinguish between default and user packages?

terdon

@DummyBeginner I very much doubt that tor is a default on Ubuntu. Just run

apt-cache show tor | grep Priority

If I'm not mistaken, the default packages will have "Important" and others will have "Optional"

DummyBeginner

@terdon Thanks. The result for tor was 'Optional'. It's 'standard' for wget

terdon

OK, Debian calls those "important"

DummyBeginner

@terdon That's strange anyway, I didn't install tor, believe me :D

terdon

Well, apparently you did. Sorry, but I'll believe the machine before the human for this type of thing :)

It might have been a requirement for something else you installed or maybe someone else did it.

DummyBeginner

6:33 PM

@terdon haha, Good one

@terdon Where could I get the installation date? The apt-cache show doesn't comprise it.

derobert

@DummyBeginner /var/log/apt if your logs go back far enough

similarly /var/log/dpkg.log

terdon

6:49 PM

That ^

muru

Or: aptitude why tor, if you have it, might tell you what dragged it in

DummyBeginner

7:05 PM

Thank guys. I found this record in a gz archived log under /var/log/apt

Start-Date: 2015-01-24 22:42:00
Commandline: apt-get install tor
Install: tor:amd64 (0.2.4.20-1), torsocks:amd64 (1.3-3, automatic), tor-geoipdb:amd64 (0.2.4.20-1, automatic)
End-Date: 2015-01-24 22:42:06

But several lines later, similar about wget was there:

Start-Date: 2015-01-25 00:14:42
Commandline: apt-get install wget
Upgrade: wget:amd64 (1.15-1ubuntu1, 1.15-1ubuntu1.14.04.1)
End-Date: 2015-01-25 00:14:46

Why is it `install` in front of commandline while it's supposed to upgrade that

derobert

apt-get install updates named packages, too

or I guess you could say it installs the newest version

DummyBeginner

Good point. hanks. It returns this, I remember installed torsocks after tor

i tor Recommends torsocks
i A torsocks Recommends tor

muru

Aptitude doesn't quite have the aptitude, I suppose.

DummyBeginner

@derobert Ok, thanks

derobert

@DummyBeginner And now you know why tor was installed, and when. Now all that's left to do is check if the question 'how do I know when I installed package FOO' is already asked on the site, and if not ask & answer it :-)

DummyBeginner

7:12 PM

@derobert you mean on askubuntu?

muru

you can ask it here. Ubuntu is OT here too. :)

Oops. OT as in on-topic.

DummyBeginner

@muru Yes, Sure

derobert

7:31 PM

@DummyBeginner here is fine too.

Victor

7:56 PM

How can I see what it will be copied with cp before I copy the files

casey

@Victor use ls

DummyBeginner

8:40 PM

@derobert @terdon @muru Here I posted and answered the question,

http://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/187989/how-do-i-know-when-i-installed-package-foo

Thanks again

muru

seen and upvoted

DummyBeginner

@muru Oh that was you :D you're my first advocate on this site, then. I appreciate that.

DummyBeginner

8:57 PM

Why is there such a overlap on topics between "Unix and Linux" and "Ask Ubuntu"? I feel my question was especially applicable to "Ask Ubuntu" but also could be asked on "Unix and Linux", How do you recommend to deal with the situation? Is there a way to put a clue to the question of this site on AskUbuntu or vice versa?

muru

Only a double-negative: If you're not using Ubuntu, don't post at AU.

DummyBeginner

I use ubuntu, BTW the link on your personal web page (university) doesn't work: "Don't believe me? Click here and try it out!"

casey

9:17 PM

@DummyBeginner AU only overlaps with us in that Ubuntu is on topic here. Anything not about Ubuntu is off-topic over there.

e.g. "I have a problem setting up a ppa" is on-topic there if you are using ubuntu, but if you mention any other distro (even if the solution is the same and applicable to ubuntu) it is no longer on topic

DummyBeginner

@casey So is it entirely appropriate to post a linux question which was encountered inside Ubuntu, on this site? (Unix and Linux). this way the restriction is one-way and not mutual, I supposed.

casey

yes, the scope at U&L is not affected by the presence of AU

DummyBeginner

@casey Thankss

casey

granted, if you question is so specific to Ubuntu that a version number is necessary info "14.10 won't do <something>", or about unity, you might be better served there, but you could still post it here

DummyBeginner

@casey Ok, sure

derobert

9:30 PM

@DummyBeginner there is a question on both sites' meta about it...

DummyBeginner

@derobert I'll check it. Thank you

derobert

Blog - Stack Exchange: Should Unix/Linux and Ubuntu Be Merged — Vote!

Jeff Atwood on August 20, 2010

Remember last week when we asked: Unix and Ubuntu: Why Both?

You may have noticed that two similar Area 51 site proposals have reached commitment and launched betas:

You might well ask: aren’t these the very same thing? Why have two communities on the same topic? What, then, is the difference between unix and ubuntu? The answer to this question cuts to the very heart of what community is.

Well, we discussed this internally, and we were torn. We felt both sides made valid and defensible arguments, both in the comments to that blog post (which were excellent, I strongly encourage you to read …

Blog - Stack Exchange: Fork it!

Joel Spolsky on September 02, 2010

First, some background. I grew up in Albuquerque, New Mexico… OK, wait a minute, you don’t need that much background.

In the beginning there was Stack Overflow. When we set up Stack Overflow, we knew people would use it to ask questions about lots and lots of different programming topics. Instead of the traditional approach, where you have a thousand different groups and sub-groups on every topic imaginable (like Usenet (comp.lang.vb.syntax.parens.unmatched, anyone?), the Stack Overflow approach was to use more free-form tags. Theoretically, tags would let you ask a question that ha …

10

Q: What is the relationship between Linux/Unix SE and Ubuntu SE

If both this SE and the Ubuntu SE make it out of beta, it might be a good idea to have some guidelines for when questions should be directed to the Ubuntu SE. Personally, I can't think of an "Ubuntu" question that wouldn't also be a "Unix and Linux" question, but at the same time (out of selfi...

@DummyBeginner There, the above three are some history.

DummyBeginner

@derobert I'm reading them. intresting.

@derobert How do you refer to links the way you did in rooms? what's the syntax?

derobert

@DummyBeginner Just paste the link, with nothing else.

They call the feature "oneboxing". Not sure if there is good documentation about all the sites that support it, other than browsing through meta.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/onebox

DummyBeginner

Aha,

derobert

9:42 PM

Though if you want to play around with chat, please join a Sandbox room...

Sandbox

Where you can play with chat features (except flagging) and ch...

3

12

DummyBeginner

Sorry, I wish I could delete them. Do you have the privilge to that for my last messages?

just getting familiar more and more with new places...

derobert

@DummyBeginner Nope, but @casey probably does. But that's just for future reference—play with chat features in the sandbox room.

terdon

There you go

casey

aww, beat me to it

derobert

@DummyBeginner the folks with funny colored nicknames are diamond-mods and can do that sort of thing

They get to do all kinds of neat things, though mostly janitorial work. I hear casey can even fly...

DummyBeginner

9:54 PM

@casey Thanks. Your majesty :D

terdon

@casey Fastest mod in the West. That's me!

DummyBeginner

Oh I meant @terdon

terdon

@DummyBeginner Yeah, watch it. I want my homage! :P

DummyBeginner

and also your highness, @casey

casey

@DummyBeginner negative, we diamond mods are janitors

everyone on SE is a moderator, we only take care of the edge cases you guys cannot

terdon

9:55 PM

@casey Dammit, we have a good thing going here, don't confuse him with facts!

derobert

@DummyBeginner I hope he's on the ground currently. Or at least has autopilot on...

casey

and handle the suggestions of those who the system hasn't trusted enough yet to act alone (i.e. not enough rep)

DummyBeginner

:)))

terdon

@derobert Egad! I can just imagine strolling down to the cockpit to find the pilot fielding flags on Aviation.

And I just wrote egad.

casey

@terdon my diamond is on earthscience.se, I'm just a high rep user over at Aviation :)

terdon

9:57 PM

@casey Oh, my bad.

I knew that actually.

DummyBeginner

How did you get there? I'll be there by tomorrow morning too,. :P

derobert

@casey Yes, I guess it would be a little more comforting for the pilot to be answering questions...

terdon

@derobert As long as he's not asking, I guess.

derobert

Now, OTOH, if the pilot were asking some of those questions there...

terdon

"HALP ME PLEASE! How do you land this thing?"

derobert

9:59 PM

@terdon #@!#( you are too fast!

terdon

:) Jinx!

derobert

@terdon "What does this warning light mean?"

casey

@terdon [help][landing] Hey guys, its cloudy here and I can't see the airport. Need to land in 15 minutes. Urgent help please!

terdon

lol

Monty Python Airplane Pilots

►

derobert

aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/475/… ← first time for everything, I guess?

terdon

10:03 PM

I'd actually read that one. I guess it was in the hot questions lists at some point.

derobert

Let's just hope OP wasn't circling the carrier at the time.

terdon

Let's...

Babbleshack

hello, is anyone knowledgeable about gummiboot?

Faheem Mitha

10:23 PM

@derobert That depends on how mucyh demand there is for the software in wheezy. Also, the harder it is to backport, the more useful it is to have it in backports.

DummyBeginner

10:39 PM

LOL on aviation thing,
SE has sites about every single topic. seriously?
what about p**ping?

Gilles

DummyBeginner

@Gilles What the heck :D

Gilles

Faheem Mitha

@Gilles ?

Gilles

@FaheemMitha pooping is on-topic on parenting, heck is on-topic on christianity

Faheem Mitha

10:45 PM

@Gilles Well, that's very helpful of you.

But I thought they called it hell.

DummyBeginner

What's happening to mankind...

Faheem Mitha

@terdon We forgive you.

derobert

11:10 PM

@FaheemMitha Well, the amount of security support required greatly ups the amount of effort I (or anyone else) would have to do for the life of Wheezy.

@DummyBeginner well, if you dumped core instead, you could ask here.

Sandbox

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