/dev/chat - 2014-07-26

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12:11 AM

@derobert - isn't hardware encryption just firmware encryption anyway? I could swear I read somewhere about a guy who hotwired the SATA +- leads on his Seagate and opened a serial terminal on his harddisk. He found the forgotten encryption key in plain text I think...

Here it is...

blacklotus89.wordpress.com/2013/11/27/ata-security-lock-2

not plain text, I guess: hdparm –security-unlock $(printf ‘\x0b\x0b\x0b\x0b’) /dev/sdb

seaget git

12:34 AM

@mikeserv that's not hardware encryption.

Or if it is, its a pretty crappy implementation (which, given, is often the case)

1:09 AM

@derobert - then I'm iffy on what is. I thought it was basically just some software written to a chip.

How do you do it otherwise?

hey

hey

hey

heh

hey

1 hour later…

2:37 AM

@FaheemMitha @derobert is this argument sound, right? I mean, make sense?

@Braiam Sounds reasonable. Not sure what you mean by synonym. You mean replace [sources.list] by [apt]?

@FaheemMitha that when you type the [sources.list] tag, the system will change it to [apt]

@Braiam I see. Yes, sounds reasonable to me. Having a separate [sources.list] tag makes no sense.

2

@FaheemMitha bows finally, someone reasonable

Good luck convincing the AU people, though.

2:45 AM

@FaheemMitha you don't have to tell me that

@Braiam :-)

is just a freaking problem just to make things right

and I believe is because they want to maintain the status quo which is ridiculously at this point of the game where the site is being in decline

I feel like in this video

@Braiam The site is in decline? How so?

@FaheemMitha they are barely keeping a 1 question, 1 answer since several months ago, and as of late, they get more questions than answers

@Braiam I see. Sounds like they need more people answering.

Is the U&L ratio better then?

2:50 AM

@FaheemMitha nah, you got it all backwards

the question quality is so bad that nobody bothers to answer question

@Braiam Funny sketch.

@Braiam Oh, ok. I don't have any idea - I don't spend time on that site.

@FaheemMitha way better, 495:642 Q vs A's

1.3 answers per question

in AU is 4 answers per 5 questions

@derobert - I only knew enough to be annoyed, but at my old job we had to migrate a bunch of systems from McAffee based encryption to some MS thing - disklocker? - that cooperated with the UEFI firmware and the TPM mystery thing - I guess it's some on-board encryption module - and the disk's firmware. Probably couldn't be beaten with a soldering iron and a morbid curiosity, but it still seems like all software. Then again - there is that TPM mystery thing, but that's not on the disk. I dunno.

@Braiam ok

Anyway, we were just valuable enough to trust us to watch two computers running the script at a time.

2 hours later…

4:39 AM

@terdon - while I don't know about the specific rules or whatever, I linked to an answer with 6 uvs on a question with 17 uvs titled Paint Pixels to Screen Using Linux Framebuffer above at SO. Seems weird that the one should be so obviously on-topic, but a similar - but not duplicate - question should be rejected.

@terdon - I'm talking about this: unix.stackexchange.com/questions/146486/…

It's weird, is all.

5:13 AM

@Braiam I love that video. it went around in The Comms Room a couple months ago.

@mikeserv BitLocker

^that

hi @strugee

@mikeserv heyo!

happy Sysadmin Appreciation Day!

that's a thing?

neat

@mikeserv yes!

well, then, and to you!

5:35 AM

So, we are a bunch of goats, going "Meh, meh, meh, meeh!" Noted. — Braiam 33 secs ago

I starred that because it's weird enough to be notable, but I have no idea what it means.

Oh. It's a link. Or it's not?

@mikeserv click the 33 secs ago

or the one in the star wall

@mikeserv thanks!

Ahhh. Yeah - I found it on the star wall.

how to disable /home directory

sigh

You disable a directory like rmdir dir

@mikeserv I can't actually tell what he's asking... hence, the VTC it has.

6:16 AM

Holy cow.

-1

A: Command to overwrite files via SSH?

Without sudo the command ssh server "cd path/to/directory && cp image1.png image2.png" doesn't have privileges to chmod the permissions. But with sudo it would, but being run after ssh, it never gets password input for it on the remote server, so the solution is use -S and pipe a password for s...

he does

ssh server " cd path/to/directory && echo sudo_password | sudo -S chmod 600 image2.png && cp image1.png image2.png"

6:42 AM

...

@Anthon - did I screw up? I dunno what a Debian public computer is...?

@mikeserv No you did not, I think the OP means "shared" computer, but if it is really public I would like to know about it.

@Anthon - Oh. Well, thanks. I at first took your comment as a well-deserved dig at me for missing the big public thing - like maybe it obviously couldn't configure quotas or something - then I read it again ... and again ... and loosely interpreted it the same way you just so concisely put it. So I asked.

guess who's using StartSSL? (hint: shoot me now)

7:08 AM

@mikeserv No it was for the OP,. I would have put @mikeserv in front if not.

oh man. that ruslan guy... I tried to be nice at first like - hey man - that's a bonehead mistake and here's why... he just keeps on. it's like I'm arguing with myself.

@strugee - yeah. it wouldn't. I realized that was probably true when writing that comment - but kept on anyway. It's why I qualified it with possibly ... wrong.

referencing this:

@mikeserv no, in that case it would just not print a line for core at all. — strugee 29 mins ago

@Anthon - 10 - 4.

7:47 AM

@mikeserv oh.

8:37 AM

Is there a good way to query for the number of processor cores? A more portable way (across Unices) would be nice, otherwise a Linux-specific one would work. An obvious approach is to parse /proc/cpuinfo. Can one do better? And is this question worth asking on the main site?

@FaheemMitha POSIX doesn't care about this stuff. You can install GNU parallel and run parallel --number-of-cores, or see how GNU parallel does it.

And yes, this is the kind of question you should ask on the site

@Gilles Ok, will do.

Hmm, apparently lscpu gives a summary. So I could parse that.

What shell fragment extracts the number at the end of:

CPU(s):                6

?

8:58 AM

@FaheemMitha lscpu | sed -n 's/^CPU(s): *//p'

but parallel --number-of-cores is easier to parse

lscpu does have the advantage of being always present on non-embedded Linux

but since it's Linux-only, you might as well use /proc/cpuinfo or /sys/devices/system/cpu/online directly

@Gilles of course, the question is which is more accurate.

apparently stuff like hyperthreading can cause confusion

@FaheemMitha They all get their information in the same place. You just need to be careful whether you want cores or CPU chips or execution threads, whether you want to include powered-off CPUs, ...

@Gilles Blimey. I just want to know how many processes I can run without them treading on each others toes.

Or, more formally, without them having to wait for each other.

@FaheemMitha parallel --number-of-cores is what parallel uses for that very purpose.

Maybe I should ask a question. assuming that this is sufficiently clearly stated.

@Gilles Hmm, sounds like the way to go, then. Thanks. Should I still ask a question on the site?

9:03 AM

This is a problem that specialists have solved for you. Use their work, and make a bug report if their solution doesn't work well for you.

@Gilles ok

parallel --number-of-cores
parallel: invalid option -- '-'

@FaheemMitha you need GNU parallel, not its predecessor

@Gilles Oh, sorry

That's the one downside I see to it: it isn't part of the default installation

@Gilles Ok, parallel in Debian apparently.

9:05 AM

but if you're going to run stuff in parallel, i.e. if you care about knowing the number of cores in the first place, you probably want to install it

@Gilles Well, I'm doing this from inside Python using the multiprocessing library. Not sure how useful GNU Parallel would be here.

Dunno if multiprocessing has a utility for discovering the numbers of cores. I guess I should check.

@FaheemMitha Ah, you want to create the threads inside a Python program? Then indeed you'd have to use the number. Or check if there's a Python library for that (there often is)

Apparently, yes

182

A: How to find out the number of CPUs in python

If you have python2.6 you can simply use import multiprocessing multiprocessing.cpu_count() http://docs.python.org/library/multiprocessing.html#multiprocessing.cpu_count

I guess it would be reasonable to use that, right?

Wow, Google really, really loves Stack Overflow.

@FaheemMitha of course

@Gilles Thanks for your help.

9:24 AM

@mikeserv Well, yeah, ultimately its probably firmware at some point. But from the operating system side, it's hardware—it speaks the normal SCSI/SATA/SAS/FC interface, and operates entirely below the OS. The crypto algorithm itself might be done in silicon (for speed; you can get e.g., off-the-shelf AES hardware).

Ideally, the whole thing is packaged together in such a way that recovering the key while its operating is next to impossible and recovering it while not operating is impossible (well, infeasible, limited by your ability to brute force it)

But I think the disk you linked to has a password on it—fairly standard feature of IDE/SATA disks for ages—and platters that are not encrypted. The hardware encrypted disks have platters that are encrypted, and work similarly to LUKS.

1 hour later…

Stéphane Chazelas

10:34 AM

@Braiam It's easy to write seven perpendicular lines provided they're not all straight (and probably make that in the shape of a kitten) and to write red lines with green or transparent ink provided it's on a mask to be put on top of a red background. That guy is no expert.

10:48 AM

@mikeserv I asked an so mod if they wanted it, he said no. Note that the question you linked to is way more comprehensive and, most importantly, includes code. The latter is what makes it firmly on topic on SO.

2 hours later…

12:57 PM

Hey, what do these error messages mean? unix.stackexchange.com/questions/146709/…

1:11 PM

yesterday, by terdon

@Ty221 Please don't post questions in chat like that. We all look at the questions as they come in, wait a while. If you've had no reply after a few hours or days, then you can ask for help here but not less than half an hour after posting!

1:22 PM

Ho my god he's BACK !

thanks slm, Anthon, rahmu, Timo, Zelda. Always you all given more negative points.. If you know the answer share to the people who doesn't, don't discourage those people. You all are human being ?? — rajcoumar 10 mins ago

@StéphaneChazelas well, he needs 7 red lines, some of them with green and transparent ink... I consider that task impossible

@Kiwy Thanks, I left him a comment.

your shinny diamond worth nothing @slm >:)

> closed as unclear what you're asking by slm♦, Anthon, rahmu, Timo, Zelda

@terdon I hope he will try to troll too much again or at list try to think out of his mental box

2:18 PM

@Braiam This has got to be the most interesting, enigmatic, and utterly confusing conversation I have ever attempted to follow here. Why should you guys need invisible ink and what does it have to do with kittens?

@derobert thank you. that makes good sense.

@terdon ditto.

Stéphane Chazelas

why not? You can even have 7 identical lines all perpendicular to each other (intersecting at a right angle) like in:

[7 lines][http://imgur.com/rBVIfQ2]

As I said, you can have some of them transparent or transparent green with a black background. That will make red lines as long as you put that on top of red background. You could also have transparent or green ink that turns red upon drying or exposed to air or via a reaction with the paper. There are plenty of ways to address those requirements.

user image

@Braiam This one predates my being a mod. That was from March 12th, why does he care at this point. Flup answered him, the Q was still hard to follow and all we were asking him to do was include the output so we could help him is the irony.

2:38 PM

@StéphaneChazelas just rub it in, man

2:54 PM

@StéphaneChazelas Clearly they should have made that video with you.

This rajcoumar chap seems unhappy.

Wow, that's a lot of downvotes.

Hmm, apparently a software engineer. I wonder who that is a picture of.

Never mind, talking to myself.

3:38 PM

Actually one could do the line drawing of a kitten. That could be considered to be a line and a kitten. I agree with the other people - the chap was being negative. :-)

@FaheemMitha - et tu, brute?

@mikeserv :-)

Currently looking at some old code I tried to parallelize, and wondering why I did it in this daft way. Does this sound familar to anyone?

Daft and overly complex, I might add. I wonder if it is worth rewriting it.

3:54 PM

Oh, wow! I get it now. Browser glitch or something - my chat window quit filling img/video tags. A refresh and it's at least as clear as ... mud.

@FaheemMitha - I eat Daft and overly complex for breakfast.

@mikeserv You do? How does it taste? Mine tastes like regret.

It's kind of bitter, with an aftertaste.

@FaheemMitha educational.

@mikeserv Is that a good flavor?

4:10 PM

@FaheemMitha an apple a day...

@mikeserv I see you've started using the reply thingy. Is this the beginning of a revolution?

@FaheemMitha viva la reply! ... or is that Las Vegas?

@mikeserv No idea.

@mikeserv how much do you know about databases? specifically postgresql?

@FaheemMitha - ...just... Daft and overly complex...

@mikeserv Huh?

4:21 PM

well, this happened

@Braiam databases, yea or nay?

@FaheemMitha depends

I tend to think that unless the chunk of data is large enough to quantify significant processing/storage advantages by linking through it, then simply comparing explicit .csv files is probably the way to go.

@Braiam On what?

What keyboard shortcuts are these?

@Braiam - sweet

4:24 PM

amount of data, transactions / queries, users, etc.

if I need to make additions, updates, and removal, is very likely I will tend to use a database

^good point

@Braiam Ok

if it's pseudo-static information, I probably will not use a database

now, what the heck is this?

0

Q: where I can deside what OS to choose? (linux OSes)

This is not a opinion base question! I want to know which of Linux distributions let me create and add my own codes to it? or a place to ask this question (I mean or where should I ask this?) I know that linux is open source and so we can add things to it and .... But I am not talking about th...

4:42 PM

@Braiam I don't know what he is talking about. Do you?

@FaheemMitha no idea

@FaheemMitha My suspicion is that you know better than he does.

5:33 PM

@Kiwy OTOH, I couldn't think of a reason for that question to be closed as unclear now, so I voted to re-open. Now its a perfectly reasonable question about finding which port a running service is listening on, in a shell script.

I've got a feeling something bad just happened to this machine.

faheem@bulldog:/usr/local/src/mercurial$ sudo dpkg -i mercurial_3.0-1_amd64.deb mercurial-common_3.0-1_all.deb
dpkg: warning: 'ldconfig' not found in PATH or not executable
dpkg: warning: 'start-stop-daemon' not found in PATH or not executable
dpkg: error: 2 expected programs not found in PATH or not executable
Note: root's PATH should usually contain /usr/local/sbin, /usr/sbin and /sbin

Anyone care to comment?

This is an old unmaintained machine I've been using for a while. Assuming it was going to die some day. Looks like this might be the day.

It starting throwing errors a bit earlier, and it looks like someone just rebooted it.

@derobert hi

@FaheemMitha That really looks like you didn't run it as root... Or your sudo config is messed up.

@derobert sudo is working for me with other commands.

@FaheemMitha do a sudo -s, then echo $PATH. Fix it if its weird, and try the dpkg -i there.

@derobert ok

@derobert What is sudo -s supposed to do here?

5:40 PM

sudo -s should give you a root shell prompt

@derobert Indeed it does. But I don't understand why.

Because that's what -s does...

anyway, once you have that root shell prompt, you can investigate the environment. E.g., echo "$PATH"

command -v ldconfig

etc.

and if the path is messed up, you can change it the normal way (PATH=…) and then run dpkg -i.

@FaheemMitha - sudo handles the password thing by getting a pty when you run it and doing theshell commands in it. The -s just opens a shell in it,

@derobert @mikeserv Ok, news to me. I guess you learn something new every day.

So, yes, PATH is messed up. Where is the recommended place to modify it?

Yep. -s gives you a normal shell. -i gives you a login shell.

5:43 PM

I don't even know where it is set.

For sudo, its set in /etc/sudoers

@derobert No, I mean PATH

for root

Use visudo to edit, and also keep a root shell open just in case you break it

Defaults	env_reset
Defaults	mail_badpass
Defaults	secure_path="/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin"

Hmm, possibly /etc/profile.

... that's where its set. In /etc/sudoers.

5:45 PM

@derobert oh.

Hmm, it is missing on this machine. Maybe someone edited it out.

The only thing there is

Defaults env_reset

Yeah. So what its doing is is keeping your user PATH.

You could add /sbin and /usr/sbin to your user's path, or change the sudo config

@derobert Right. Thanks. That was very helpful. It would have taken me hours to figure that out.

@FaheemMitha I think you get to write this up as a question now.

@derobert I'll just add back what was supposed to be in /etc/sudoers.

My guess would be some moron accidentally removed it.

Or because he/she has some extra stuff in his/her user path, and wants to keep that.

5:50 PM

@derobert Don't follow.

@derobert Well, let me try and fix this first.

/etc/sudoers is insisting it is read-only. both emacs and jed.

suggestions?

@FaheemMitha You're supposed to edit it by running visudo

@derobert heh

@FaheemMitha which despite the name respects EDITOR and VISUAL, so you can use your preferred editor

@derobert oh, gorblimey.

@FaheemMitha Say you have customized the path in your user login. Maybe added /opt/something/bin, or even /home/user/bin. And you have some shell scripts that call those programs, so they depend on PATH. You'd get annoyed about sudo resetting your PATH if you had to run those shell scripts as root.

@FaheemMitha visudo invokes your editor on a temp file, then syntax checks it before replacing the real file. Useful, because if there is a syntax error, you'd next be asking how to recover root access to your system...

5:56 PM

@derobert Hmm. This is quite recent, and this machine is unmaintained. My guess would be probably an accident.

@derobert Right. I'm a dumbo.

I used to know this once, but forgot.

Seems to be working now. So, what question should I write?

And who is going to answer?

@derobert ^^

@FaheemMitha Well, your original post with the error messages was basically a question.

@derobert this is what makes sudo crazy. If you look through its manual - it's basically a suid screen.

@derobert Yes, actually I was going to post that in. It would be like a detective drama. Like NCIS or something. Except except of a corpse, there is a misbehaving machine.

I suppose I'd write the answer. Seems like if we're going to wind up doing Q&A in chat, we ought to at least post it to the site afterward so future folks can benefit

^!!

6:04 PM

@derobert Ok, just finishing up. Will ping you when done.

0

Q: What do you do when you try to sudo and root's PATH has gone kerblooey?

So, I just posted the following on chat I've got a feeling something bad just happened to this machine. faheem@bulldog:/usr/local/src/mercurial$ sudo dpkg -i mercurial_3.0-1_amd64.deb mercurial-common_3.0-1_all.deb dpkg: warning: 'ldconfig' not found in PATH or not executable dpkg: warning: 's...

@derobert ^^ Feel free to correct my idiosyncratic wording.

And add tags as necessary.

@derobert Actually - allow me to rephrase that. This is what makes sudo crazier than su (which is more than a little crazy itself). Both are basically suid screens, but sudo tries to pretend it isn't.

I doubt they do anything nearly as complicated as screen. But I haven't checked the source.

Their manual makes it look pretty close.

This is apparently the only occurence of kerblooey on the site. How gratifying.

@Braiam overly drastic edit. How do I roll this thing back?

@FaheemMitha I removed all the noise and overuse of the code blocks

6:16 PM

@FaheemMitha answered. Let me know if I missed anything.

@Braiam Hey, I like my noise!

You sound just like Gilles.

Oh man - I didn't see this before: man sudo:

...
Plugins
Plugins may be specified via Plugin directives in the
sudo.conf(5) file. They may be loaded as dynamic shared
objects (on systems that support them), or compiled directly
into the sudo binary. If no sudo.conf(5) file is present,
or it contains no Plugin lines, sudo will use the tradi‐
tional sudoers security policy and I/O logging. See the
sudo.conf(5) manual for details of the /etc/sudo.conf file
and the sudo_plugin(8) manual for more information about the
sudo plugin architecture.

@FaheemMitha when I grow up, I want to be a gilles

5

:P

@Braiam You're on your way.

I mean, it's an awesome application - but it's just amazing to me that it is included with regular desktop distributions. It's insanely powerful. Most people just need rsh or something.

6:19 PM

@derobert should I add more stuff to my question, or is it Ok as it stands?

Like the value of PATH before fixing, which I don't think I recorded.

Don't think it matters—the answer includes that step

@derobert Turns out I had the broken value of PATH in scrollback. I added it to the question. Makes it look a little more coherent.

OK

@derobert you're good at this stuff. did you go to debugging school? :-)

@FaheemMitha The prestigious University of Hard Knocks, maybe.

6:24 PM

@derobert Yes, I think I've visited their campus.

30 mins ago, by derobert

@FaheemMitha Say you have customized the path in your user login. Maybe added /opt/something/bin, or even /home/user/bin. And you have some shell scripts that call those programs, so they depend on PATH. You'd get annoyed about sudo resetting your PATH if you had to run those shell scripts as root.

<---- that's been me before

So I know all about sudo resetting my path... Though I didn't change the sudo config, I just added PATH= to the top of my script.

OK, back to trying to do some real work

@derobert That sounds more sensible.

Wouldn't editing the sudo config break things for other users?

@FaheemMitha Yes, it would. As you've just found out.

I think currently this machine has only one other user, and it is sort of the boneheaded thing he would do. I think I'll drop him an email. Or maybe just a link to this question.

(Though you can actually have custom sudo config per-command, or per-user. So I could actually have done it in sudoers safely)

6:35 PM

@derobert If someone did it deliberately, I'm not sure why he/she would have removed

Defaults        mail_badpass

as well.

@mikeserv What application?

7:03 PM

debian got bumblebee packages

@FaheemMitha - the application of pseudo terminals to permissions control - e.g. suid screen.

@FaheemMitha - ssh does a lot of the same.

@mikeserv I see.

@FaheemMitha - make that transparent pseudo terminals for permissions control. It's another two or three layers on top of the conventional getty > login scheme plus all manner of config dependent <ins | outs> in the meanwhile.

@mikeserv This is all too complicated for me. I'm just a humble user.

Me too. That's why I said it amazes me that something that complicated is included by default on regular desktop distros.

7:18 PM

@mikeserv What's the alternative. An OS probably includes all sorts of complicated terminology that users don't know about.

Maybe, but the alternative is - Hmm. That file is not in my home directory but I need to edit it. CTRL+F[NEXT] - root - masterpassword - edit.

@mikeserv I think sysadmins like sudo because it keeps a log of everything typed.

So does the console - page by page it's even served in /dev/ for each vt and can be logged as simply as tail /dev/vc[num]. It's maybe a little more simple than - Hmm. That file is not in my home directory and I need to edit it. I sure hope I configured the 1001 cryptic /etc/sudoers lines correctly. sudo here_goes_nothing

sudo is great for sysadmins. When root is the superuser there is only one masterpassword. This is incredibly insecure because as soon as you have more than one sysadmin they have to share it. Pretty soon it's root's pw is stickied under every keyboard in the building.

At least that's the way it could go. It might also be that the sysadmins properly configure group ownerships and sticky bits and all of that and then all's well. But that's a lot more work than looking at the bottom side of the keyboard.

1 hour later…

8:48 PM

@FaheemMitha I like sudo because su is a pile of cow dung

@Patrick Why is it a pile of cow dung?

@FaheemMitha It doesn't support passing arguments, you have to use a full shell command. It barely has any options to control the environment that gets used, and if I recall correctly, su is noisy as hell when it comes to logging, where sudo isn't (but i could be completely wrong on this point, it's been a while)

@Patrick i see. I must admit I don't pay much attention to these tools. Though people here seem to have strong opinions.

@Patrick - it is certainly less sophisticated than sudo.

sudo can do everything su can. there is nothing su can do that sudo cant

8:54 PM

Mostly, if it works, I just ignore it.

@Patrick - there is some difficulty with sudo and passing through file descriptors numbered greater than 2 because sudo gets its own pty. It can be done, but it requires a bunch more configuration.

isn't there a problem with sudo and shell builtins? e.g. sudo cd...

yes, but su -c cd wouldn't work either

@Patrick True

But one can use su and then do what you want.

sudo can too

8:58 PM

@Patrick you mean sudo -s?

if youre talking about getting a shell, sure

@Patrick I guess I am

@FaheemMitha if you need to use sudo cd ... you are doing it wrong ;)

@Braiam < this.

@Braiam Why?

8:59 PM

@Braiam There might be cases where a cd is appropriate. The directory may be 700 owned by root, so you can't get into it.

But why would you ever change into that directory in the first place?

@mikeserv my point

@Patrick in such cases I normally do sudo ls /dir and then directly execute sudo /dir/whatever

@Braiam But what if the application being launched needs to run from that directory. It's not too uncommon

@Patrick - ok. I won't deny it because I don't know that it is impossible - but I'm curious about why it should be? Do you mean the executable interprets only relative pathnames and must affect the filesystem?

If so, I would argue that it is not a very good design - anything sitting in a directory like that must be important enough to handle with care, and so it should make no assumptions about its environment. All environment should be defined explicitly at invocation else it should instantly fail.

9:15 PM

@Braiam what's up with unix.stackexchange.com/questions/139586/… vs. unix.stackexchange.com/questions/146764/…

@UlrichDangel I knew I did something similar but when searching in google never found it

and I presumed "heck, maybe in a dream"

9:33 PM

lovely message:

> If you did not request a download, someone else must have entered your email address on our site, and you may completely ignore this message (we won't re-send it or contact you again). Or hey, click the link anyway and check out some great free music!

9:45 PM

@Braiam Wouldn't searching on the site itself be more effective?

@FaheemMitha nope

@Braiam Why not?

@FaheemMitha SE search sucks

@Braiam Worth a shot

10:08 PM

@Gnouc - you out there?

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