Game Development - 2016-10-24 (page 1 of 2)

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PearsonArtPhoto

12:43 AM

This keeps getting more and more complex... Sigh...

4 hours later…

user92578

4:22 AM

@jgallant flood fill is obviously the answer there... his question seems to want to start a discussion though and isn't very clear to me. Something something diagonals duplicate question something

Free Internet Points

7:42 AM

0

Q: How do I create a closed beta on Google Play?

As per suggestion I'm splitting How do I create a closed beta on Google Play or the App Store? up. Can I upload the game I'm developing to Google Play as a closed beta, so I could generate a couple of keys/tokens for my testers? I'm hoping to only publish the game for the public after I'm happy ...

google-play playtesting beta

3 hours later…

10:31 AM

He commented again

Telling me to properly read his question.

What a fucken piece of shit.

user92578

I'll help

I commented back.

All he wants is someone to tell him he is smart.

I edited the question. He literally wrote "hmmmmmm I pause that might work'

what question

0

Q: determin if a shape of tiles is closed

I’ve been in the process of trying to workout if a shape is closed. I decided to use VB.net as my language of choice. Red = walls Light Blue = water Black = Towers Dark Blue = Fill A similar question was asked here: Determine if a set of tiles on a grid forms an enclosed shape A lot o...

tiles grid shape

You need to read it before edit

11:11 AM

This was the most retarded thing of the day on GDSE

"9 years professional programmer", complains about a good answer, but if he really were that good he wouldn't even make a question to start with

Kevin van der Velden

It's not as if every programmer is a good programmer

I'm sure the off-shore people in india have programmed for many years as well

Yeah IKR, that's exactly my point, if time meant real experience and knowledge then fine, but no one gives a damn for how many years you how to code a if

Guys he is using vb.net

By choice.

Over c#

Nuff said

Kevin van der Velden

I'm working in VB.net right now =[

I am sad

lol good point

11:19 AM

By choice?

Kevin van der Velden

Sorta, there's a third party library we're using that has a security issue

I'm fixing it and then compiling it and locking up the source in a vault

Vault 69

In fallout vault 69 is the vault where there was 1 male and the rest all female

Ah good thing that I'm not the only one that remembered Fallout Vaults when reading "vault"

Kevin van der Velden

I dunno, I don't think they deserve having VB dropped on them, trump probably has a vault somewhere I'll just drop it in there

12:08 PM

Anyone get BF1 yet?

Wondering if the multiplayer is shit like battlefront

Or of I have to spend 300 dollars to play

I miss the good old days of gaming

Kevin van der Velden

Nah, not my game

165$CND

Well that's it then fuck that game.

300 BRL here

so that's bout 90 euros

12:11 PM

The most expensive game I've ever seen

I paid 70 euros for wow CE box and considered that very ridiculous amount of money for a game, but I wanted it anyway

nowdays I won't buy CE boxes any more

Fuck this game in the ass seriously

Kevin van der Velden

Well CE boxes are different, you get more for the money, so it makes perfect sense that they're more expensive

WAR is the last CE boxed game I have got

aka warhammer online

I got the CE box just to get in to the beta, and it flopped completely for me and I quit it even before the release

What is CE?

12:16 PM

And yeah I agree they are different and offer you more

Collector's Edition

I just have so bad experiences from pre-purchasing something

And paying ridiculous amounts of money

Well, the closest to it I made was buying early access games

In my case it were KF2 and Starbound

user92578

9 flags from marshal :P

user92578

way to kill the conversation, Tyyppi!

Heh

user image

user92578

12:28 PM

lol

Kevin van der Velden

@Lasse WITCHCRAFT! BURN THE HERETIC

12:44 PM

When reading the fucken manual goes wrong.

user92578

I'm taking a math course on complex numbers and it's really fucking awesome

All I remember from complex numbers is i = sqrt(-1)

user92578

Yeah that's the base

user92578

Complex numbers come in handy when rotating in a 2D plane

user92578

Then there's also the cool e^(i*pi)=-1 thing

user92578

12:54 PM

I just realized that Mick never really came back (not that it's a bad thing)

See I learned all this math before I did game programming. So most of the math I learned I didn't really give a shit about at the time.

user92578

I'm not really sure if I'd want to actually use them though... I'd think that using the unit circle would be a lot more readable

user92578

(Oh, sin and cos! This code must be doing rotations or calculating positions based on rotations)

user92578

But yeah essentially complex numbers are the quaternions of 2D

And mick did come back but he hates it here

user92578

12:57 PM

never really came back

user92578

Hasn't been around in 18 days

He's on discord

user92578

Yeah I figured

I have pizza

But it's 10 am

user92578

nice

12:58 PM

I feel like I need to wait a little bit longer

user92578

lol

PearsonArtPhoto

Dev Blog- Sea Trading Game kd7uiy.com/2016/10/dev-blog-sea-trading-game-improving.html Improved selling price, make factory goods, and produce seeds!

onionstudios.com/videos/…

Kevin van der Velden

@jgallant yes, requirements to be polite and such are such a drag =[

user92578

@PearsonArtPhoto Nice stuff!

user92578

1:01 PM

@jgallant CSS isn't loading for me

PearsonArtPhoto

It's coming along slowly...

user92578

So is that the ship stuff that you've been struggling with the last few days?

PearsonArtPhoto

I spent far too long just thinking about how to do certain parts.

The ship is easy.

The problem I'm running in to is making a reasonable AI system for the cities to tell them what to make.

user92578

Oh I see, that does seem like a tough thing.

PearsonArtPhoto

The first order pass worked reasonably well, but I'm struggling to get it to the next level...

user92578

1:03 PM

On the other hand, you could just make them produce anything and give international monetary support to everyone :P

Needs more docks

user92578

Like IRL it doesn't really make sense to grow pretty much anything here in Finland, but thanks to EU support some farmers can still make a living here

PearsonArtPhoto

I can do that pretty easily, it's just a bit of a tweak to my parameter file.

So far my crops are very much based on the climate in the United States.

You should add a tradable item called RumHam

PearsonArtPhoto

I'm needing to add things that can be planted in other locations.

I should at least add pigs, so I can have Ham in the game...

user92578

1:05 PM

Yeah. So does that essentially come down to a map lookup? Or..?

Then rum

PearsonArtPhoto

They are biome dependent.

So for instance, Barley I think grows better in the colder climates.

(I forget off hand, but...)

user92578

Yeah so city.ProduceGood(goodMap.RandomGood(city.area.Biome));?

PearsonArtPhoto

It's a bit more complex than that...

user92578

Yeah I can understand that.

user92578

1:08 PM

What kind of other factors do you have that affect the good?

PearsonArtPhoto

There are about a dozen "Modifiers" that will change the production.

user92578

Aight yeah I've never made anything complex like that

PearsonArtPhoto

So there is one for anything that requires something else to help produce it, called seeds.

Kevin van der Velden

What's the goal of a city? Maximize their profit, or build a certain set of goods?

PearsonArtPhoto

There are some based on temperature, tools available, location type (Biome or "factory" building), etc.

The goals of the city vary, but they can be to make a profit, simply survive, or keep their people happy.

Kevin van der Velden

1:11 PM

The latter 2 are basically "Make at minimum these things"?

And the first one is "Make the things that sell best and cost the least to make"?

PearsonArtPhoto

Right.

Although that's not really how I do it.

I really think I'm going to have to overhaul a good chunk of that system... Sigh.

The more I look in to it, the more I realize it's just not quite ready... Still, it's good enough to at least get a sense for how it can work.

Kevin van der Velden

I think you could represent it as a maximum flow problem, but not sure how yet

Your project has been a total revamp of the systems in it all the time (not that's a bad thing, but you're looking to make it really good)

user92578

@KevinvanderVelden Seems like a lot of variables to me, but that's actually a very interesting idea

PearsonArtPhoto

There are certainly things that haven't been revamped much with time.

I'll look in to it, hmmm...

user92578

1:15 PM

I wouldn't necessarily call that revamping but polishing

PearsonArtPhoto

Many things I put up what was essentially a skeleton until I could figure out exactly what I wanted and how I wanted to do it.

The map system has essentially been identical to what it was when I first set it up as I had envisioned, for instance. I did make 1 very small tweak, but it was pretty minor, so...

Movement has remained mostly the same, except I improved the speed of my A* algorithm quite a bit.

I'm curious now, what class file do I have that hasn't changed for a long time...

Most of the UI stuff hasn't changed much, although it's overdue for some polishing...

Wow, I don't really have very many stable classes. I'm not quite sure what that means...

user92578

It means that you're working a lot.

PearsonArtPhoto

1:31 PM

I knew that the piece that I'm working on now would be complex, but that it would be the key to the entire game...

I'm starting to get there, but... Sometimes it seems a bit insurmountable. Still, it's coming along slowly.

Ahhhhh pizza.

Never trust someone that doesn't like pizza

user92578

user image

Kill him.

user92578

sprites need work, they need to be faster and there's no kill functionality yet

Darn :}

user92578

1:38 PM

that should be quite simple though I think

user92578

Actually, what do you think of that sprite?

I like it.

user92578

I kinda ripped off a pixel art skull that I found on google image search

user92578

I probably should alter a few pixels

Heh. You are such an asshole stealing other people's work the shame!

user92578

1:47 PM

well there's only that many ways you can draw a skeleton head with the resolution in question :P

Send that guy that creates that pixel skull 1 dollar

user92578

naw I tweaked it

user92578

looks more tall now

user92578

user image

Kevin van der Velden

So in short: Don't stop on blocks with skulls on them. Seems reasonable

1:52 PM

I'll certainly try to trap enemies in this just to see the blood

@jgallant did you download GORB from that link i sent?

user92578

Now I kinda want to make a horizontal version too

user92578

That might actually be a lot harder because I don't have horizontal crushing implemented

Kevin van der Velden

How many levels are you going to use the feature in? Is it worth it =p

user92578

Probably not a lot.

user92578

2:02 PM

Yeah I think I'll just stick with vertical crush traps

Kevin van der Velden

Pragmatism saves the day again \o/

user92578

yeah thanks

Kevin van der Velden

At least I think that's the word, I 'unno. You know what I'm talking about

user92578

yup

user92578

now code clean, then commit, and then levels

2:56 PM

@almo not yet.

link lives for like 2 weeks

so not a huge hurry

3:16 PM

Hey, I've been noticing something weird lately. Every single one of my questions has been downvoted, and not only that but even the answer I wrote for myself (clearly explaining what the problem was) was also downvoted.

the only thing I can figure (given a comment that was previously deleted) is that "this is 3D game maker and you cannot do that so heres a downvote"

is that really the case

could someone look for me please?

user92578

I'm not sure

user92578

Those seem like reasonable questions to me

@TheGreatDuck serial downvoting usually gets caught by a script that hunts for that shit

if it's one person doing it, they should find it

Kevin van der Velden

I don't really think it's serial downvoting, the questions just aren't very good

Half of them are a dump of code with a self answer

@Almo Well I know from my experience that there are a large number of people who think "You shouldn't do 3D in game maker, period".

user92578

3:26 PM

Nothing wrong with self answering though

^

user92578

Like for anyone using Game Maker to make 3D stuff those questions are now a great resource

@KevinvanderVelden I specifically describe a problem though. One is supposed to "dump their code" when they have a problem.

Kevin van der Velden

@Tyyppi_77 No they're not, because the questions are still bad =p

@TheGreatDuck one is supposed to provide a minimal reproducing sample

@KevinvanderVelden That is the minimal reproducing sample.

user92578

3:28 PM

"uuuh, only part of my 3D model is rendering in GM, I better google this"

@Tyyppi_77 you don't understand though

user92578

> The issue is that in older versions of game maker, models were stored in arrays which have a maximum storage of 32000 indexes, or roughly 10000 polygons.

Kevin van der Velden

I think question would be a good question after some editing: gamedev.stackexchange.com/questions/131729/…

there are people who actually think "you just shouldn't be using GM to begin with so this question should be deleted because it's game maker"

user92578

I'm trying to argue that atleast that question is a good question

3:29 PM

@KevinvanderVelden my question got an answer. Therefore, it is a good question.

user92578

The weird thing is that all your answers/questions seem to have 3 downvotes

^

user92578

@TheGreatDuck That's not a thing though.

Kevin van der Velden

And the others are not a minimal sample, in one of them you've included loading for a dozen irrelevant things

But not included the relevant thing (or a description of the file, that would've sufficed)

@TheGreatDuck Yeah, no it doesn't work that way. A question is good on it's own merits. Answerabillity is indeed one of the things a good question has, but not the only thing

because that is the code that I ran to make it work.

Kevin van der Velden

3:32 PM

Minimal reproducible sample, not dump your code

what if it were loading a dozen irrelevant things that make it break?

Kevin van der Velden

Is it? Did you test that?

Because from your own answer that's not the case

no, because I'm not idiot

also, I was told that answer by someone else

Kevin van der Velden

@TheGreatDuck Then why bring it up?

because you brought it up

Kevin van der Velden

3:33 PM

Erm, no? I'm talking about you bringing up the idea that the irrelevant code broke it

That's specifically is the irrelevant code that should be removed to get a minimal sample

and you asked why the supposedly "irrelevant code" was there

my point is that when asking the question I had no knowledge of what was or was not relevant.

Kevin van der Velden

Why didn't you test it then?

because I didn't think to test that.

there was no reason it would break

that would be idiocy

Kevin van der Velden

So why paste it in? =p

The fact that you preserved it means either a) you thought it relevant or b) you just copy pasted everything

Note, I'm not saying you should be banned from the site or have the things deleted but I am saying that the questions need work to be good questions. Which is a valid reason to downvote them

(I didn't incidentally)

And this is all, of course, my opinion. I don't mean it as an attack on you, I just have high standards for questions here

you're kind of starting to be rude, no offense. you're jumping on me saying I just "copy/pasted" everything. If I'm asking a question about code in game maker then should be posting all the code that was executed for that particular thing, period. It is the minimal number of things that were executed. There were lots of other junk that I got rid of. I kept everything involving the graphics, period.

Kevin van der Velden

3:40 PM

Actually the idea of a minimal reproducible sample is that you get just the code that makes the problem appear, in as few lines as possible. So to get a minimal reproducible sample, ideally, you should have tested if those extra loading things broke it (you have the thing set up after all, it's not much work for you), and if it didn't break it you'd remove it

"that the questions need work to be good questions" except what you don't understand which is what I tried to tell you before, right before I received the downvotes on some of them a very rude individual came by and said "3D in game maker?!? Delete all your code right now you idiot, restart your project and go use unity."

Kevin van der Velden

Yeah that guy is rude and an ass

Totally agree with you there

@TheGreatDuck did he really say that?

what a prick :(

I don't have the powa so I can't delete the comment

but I would

Kevin van der Velden

I believe it's already been deleted? And you can flag as offensive

@KevinvanderVelden It's literally two lines. I don't see how it's that big of a deal. I think you are way stretching it way out of proportion. I mean, literally, the only reason the first code is even written as anything other than one line is because a moderator came by and tried to demand that "your code must be formatted perfectly and you may not have them written on one line like this, period"

I did flag as offensive

it's already gone

just saying i probably got a downvote or two from them

Kevin van der Velden

3:44 PM

Possible

@KevinvanderVelden Honestly, I would prefer to have just left the first code on one line, and not expand it. There's not much useful there. I mostly just left it the way it was so people could replicate the problem the same way I had it.

but that still doesn't really explain this question having 3 downvotes?

-3

Q: Do game maker's 3D rotation transformations use intrinsic or extrinsic rotations upon axes?

I have a pretty difficult problem on my hands. My 3D character moves through space and rotates. I do not know the angle of rotation at any given time, but I do have 3 x,y,z unit vectors serving as the character's coordinate system. I see that in the euler angle page on wikipedia (https://en.wiki...

rotation game-maker

Kevin van der Velden

And it's not 2 lines, I'm talking about the first big* code bit in this one, it's 16 lines out of 18 (not counting empty lines) (this is a link, the color is barely differentiable)

@TheGreatDuck well 3 people thought it bad enough to downvote, there's no method to see who did so

@KevinvanderVelden yeah, but what is wrong with it?

clearly there must be something wrong if it isn't just people downvoting for no reason. :p

Kevin van der Velden

Minor nitpicking on formatting, otherwise I really don't know

That's a good question in my opinion =p

well most people will downvote anything involving game maker from what I understand

are you familiar with it?

3:48 PM

"most people"

if "most people" downvoted any GM related question, you'd have WAY MORE than 3 downvotes there.

@Almo From what I understand, most people think of game maker as a tool young children use and that it is completely inappropriate as a game engine

you don't need to ping me every time

"most people"

Kevin van der Velden

@TheGreatDuck I edited the nitpicking things I had with it

how do you have any idea what "most people" think about GM?

Kevin van der Velden

Because hey, I was gonna list them here and it's easier to just edit them ^^

3:50 PM

I don't think that about it

I mean, Nidhogg, a popular game on Steam was made with it

What I mean to say, is that game maker is very much looked down upon as a tool, and then those who don't like will also quite vividly say that "you are no supposed to do 3D in game maker".

you wouldn't believe how many times I've noticed people literally say things like "just switch to unity. 3D in game maker isn't worth doing"

Kevin van der Velden

Game maker is pretty cool, though it has some limitations due to design decisions that are annoying but meh

i know the one guy I mentioned was being rude, but there's a large number of people who have the same attitude and are just nicer about it

what's really confusing here though:

-1

Q: Why is game maker displaying a model without all of its polygons?

I have a game maker saved model that I created and saved in a little generator I made. I loaded it into a game made in what I think was game maker 6.0 (I used an ad-hoc-ed execute_string() cheat system to "add" graphical control so bear with me if I don't know the exact version). The problem is t...

game-maker mods

I answered the question and the answer got downvotes as well

Not that it's that big of a deal

but it seems like people have something against the answer as well

@TheGreatDuck "very much looked down upon" I don't get where you're getting these data from.

I don't know anyone personally who "looks down on it"

Kevin van der Velden

He does have way more downvotes than normal

3:54 PM

^

that doesn't mean it's because they don't like GM

Kevin van der Velden

Hmmm, I think the answer on that one is upvoteworthy

The question isn't though IMHO

and like I said, it only takes a few people to get "more downvotes than normal" nowhere near "most people"

you'd have a hundred downvotes if "most people" downvote any GM question on principle.

probably more

Reddit, the game maker community itself, apparently at least one user on this site, most past users of game maker that I know, etc.

Anecdotal evidence prone to confirmation bias.

3:55 PM

It's been rare for me to bump into someone that didn't have some quarrel with game maker.

Kevin van der Velden

It is viewed poorly in a lot of circles, but a lot of circles are elitist jerks

(pentagons are cool though, not like circles at all)

I'm not saying people who hate GM downvoted it.

I'm just saying it's probably part of the problem (especially considering one person already expressed rude attitudes towards my questions).

@TheGreatDuck you've bumped into a lot of people in this very chatroom who have no problem with it

I even considered using it

Kevin van der Velden

I learned programming in it

I only decided against it because I already have a lot of experience with Unity

due to using it at work

3:58 PM

fair enough

this is actually an oddity

Kevin van der Velden

I made my first bit of programming money with it

on most websites, if I came here asking the same thing, I would literally be cursed out of the chat.

glad to know people here aren't the same

People would hate you whenever you talked about engines that aren't Unreal

But you shouldn't care

This guy is an idiot

@DH. Actually most of them advocate unity for some reason. Honestly, in my opinion, Unity is a worse piece of junk.

4:01 PM

People associate bad games to engines, but actually the problem is that engines are free, so you can't stop stupid people from doing their stupid things

See.

granted, that's my bias of javascript coming through.

Kevin van der Velden

I don't like all of unity but it's pretty great

@TheGreatDuck oh yeah don't use "booscript", use C# =p

no I use C.

my versions of game maker are still just in GML

no direct relation to any C_

Kevin van der Velden

C is even better, but I was talking about in unity where you can't really do that

4:02 PM

oh

no my bias is 100% against JS

you do know how JS was developed right?

I'm sure you are gonna tell us regardless

2 weeks

basically, some company said "we need a language for web application stuff"

@TheGreatDuck I wouldn't call it worse, since it gives you more freedom at the same time you have to do more stuff on your own, and well, Unity is mostly used for 3D stuff which is really strong point

and the head developer said

"ill get it done in two weeks"

4:04 PM

Douglas Crockford said "I challenge you to design and implement a new language in 2 weeks and have it turn out as well as Javascript did."

so he literally coded a language in two weeks

Kevin van der Velden

Yeah, but the guy making it was actually a good programmer that had already designed languages before.

that might be awesome and good for him

Kevin van der Velden

Unlike PHP

hahaha PHP

4:05 PM

but I honestly feel that nobody can design a language in under a month or two. It's just not reasonable of an expectation.

Kevin van der Velden

I'm fairly sure that the javascript after 2 days of work was better then PHP's first release

people realize problems in the syntax, clunky tools, etc.

Kevin van der Velden

@TheGreatDuck well it did copy heavily from other languages

@KevinvanderVelden it probably was.

well, I just try to avoid it if it's not incredibly neccessary.

and yeah sure, the guy who made it was definitely a genuis, no doubt.

Kevin van der Velden

@TheGreatDuck the maker of JS said so so I'm gonna believe him =p

4:07 PM

but imagine if he had 2 months instead of two weeks

and that's basically my argument towards JS in a nutshell

I gotta go

also, since I now know in context

I removed those redundant commands

Kevin van der Velden

I think you're falling for the 90/10 issue. And he had 2 weeks for the initial version, bugfixes were probably waaaay more =p

I'm not talking about the code of the language

im talking about the specification of the language

the syntax is incredibly clunky at times

anyway, I gotta go.

Kevin van der Velden

Same here, hooooome o/

(I don't care if people use JS. I just don't personally like using it.)

(Ironically GML is 90% like JS)

XD

Errr no

GML is more C'ish

4:10 PM

yeah

it's typed, right?

I guess JS is typed... but very loosely

what's the term for it? object prototyping or something?

user92578

Oh BTW thanks for the Twitter thing Almo, yours got more likes than my original tweet <3

GML is typed but it depends on the value you initialize it, JS, well, it's a nightmare

user92578

How is this still open? gamedev.stackexchange.com/questions/131897/…

Maybe it didn't got flagged enough to get attention?

@Tyyppi_77 ;)

4:16 PM

I still remember how annoyed and strange was the first time I got a "quack" error in JS

4:28 PM

A manager told the guy next to me to stop taking calls over speaker phone

It annoyed the other employees lol.

Common sense.

Kevin van der Velden

4:53 PM

@jgallant \o/

5:10 PM

He is on a call right now over speaker.

Dude doesn't give a fuck

How would you check if a row is valid in picross?

Kevin van der Velden

Is fire an option?

No

5:25 PM

@TheGreatDuck Although I say that JS is awesome, it definitely has some quirks

I still don't understand why the following works

(function() {console.log("Hello");}())

While this doesn't

function() {console.log("Hello");}()

but this also works

!function() {console.log("Hello");}()

I wouldn't check for a valid row, you know, it has that problem of multiple solutions that satisfy the condition

It's for something else. I need to check if a row is currently valid or not.

But I can't seem to get it done properly

My main issue is partially completed tags

I don't think there is any way to check without looking at all possibilities

@jgallant What are you having a problem with?

5:41 PM

Hold on I got an idea

@Bálint i dont actually know JS. I just know it is ugly as medusa.

Fuck man

Basically I want to determine if a configuration is valid or not for just a single row.

5:56 PM

@TheGreatDuck Well, every language can be ugly, it really depends on who writes it

6:22 PM

So, I make an array with Filled in tile sizes

And another with blanks

Then I cross reference these from left to right with the meta tags

If a fill is larger than its associated meta tag, then it is invalid

if a fill is smaller than a potential meta tag -- needs to have specified number of blank spaces beside it to be valid

I can't think of a clever way to verify this shit...

7:18 PM

The only sane thing to do is pre-calculate every combination once in a indexed collection

Then use this as a means to check if a combination is valid or not.

7:30 PM

Is that really "sane"?

:)

I think so...

haha ok :)

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