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Zoe
7:23 AM
@JackDouglas I may be able to go the your friend's Church tmr :D
 
 
5 hours later…
12:17 PM
I have yet to hear any Calvinists make such an argument based on this translation or even the verse in general. I don't know why the word choice was made by the ESV translators, but the word they picked does not seem to carry the particular implication you are reading into it. A more modern expression might be "Of course", as in "Of course you can go to the party, just come home by 10." This doesn't seem to have any different implications than "freely", and the doctrinal case for whether the fall was predestined is surely not built on this verse. — Caleb ♦ 1 hour ago
^^^ @Caleb - very nicely put!
 
@Davïd And your answer to that is fantastic. With that background I'm actually surprised there isn't more variety in translations (although almost all the ones quoted have similar derivations).
For context, that OP has a serious bone to pick with Reformed theology in general and me in particular (mod issues over on CSE that he blames my Calvinism for although I contend it's unrelated).
> This video is unavailable with Safety Mode enabled. To view this video, you will need to disable Safety Mode.
 
12:47 PM
@Caleb I sensed a chip resting on a shoulder somewhere...
@Caleb Hmmm - wonder why? It's a very gentle scene - not sure why it would be flagged?
 
@Davïd No clue, but it happens a lot. I mostly keep the mode on just so I don't have to see comments below everything. Less distracting / maddening. It's not actually useful for much else.
 
 
4 hours later…
5:09 PM
@JackDouglas How do you see the books of Wayne Grudem? I've never read any.
On the other hand, I wonder how those percentages are obtained. What algorithm is used?
 
 
1 hour later…
6:21 PM
@Caleb Succumbed to doing a little browsing, and ran across this Q&A. It struck me that you might be interested in James Anderson's blog and publications. Run across it before?
@PaulVargas @JackDouglas Here's another guy who has tried running comparison numbers. Interesting to see its comments, too - what do you "count"?!
 

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